3.8 whipple

[fubar569]

I located a seemingly proven Gen 5 3.0 Stage 2 kit about 3hrs away from home - 3k miles so if there were any serious issues they'd have surfaced by now. Also likely out of warranty though.

I've never been more tempted but dammit whipple...

Also...waiting to see if I accidentally fall into an 04 Mach 1 for a sensible no f#%ks given daily and drag week plan B before I get super tarded with either the hellcat or a chevelle.

 

[Jroc]

Check the rotors. Two easy ways to do that. Pull the lid to see the rear or pull the throttle body to check the front (easiest). The original billet version in the first picture. It’s got 30 passes plus dyno time on it now and makes a ton of power. Over 1400whp at 3000’ elevation thru a T400. It’s still in perfect condition. The second picture is thru the front of another that started eating itself. We’ve found that they don’t like rpm. Anything smaller than a 3.50 pulley is a problem. Stay tuned. It’s a saga. 😂 View attachment 132919 View attachment 132920

Mine’s a billet one as well, no rotor wear last time I checked but I think I’ll take another look.

Here is my 3.8 at idle....

That sounds perfect, I wish mine sounded like that!

 

[16GoManGoHC2]

Yes. We only use the +10 balancers.

My last Gen 6 3.8 lasted less then 100 miles, 3-4 street pulls and 3 4th gear dyno pulls and the rotors ate each other and the housing this time too!!
+10 ATI lower and 3.50 Satera CLUTCHED UPPER PULLEY and it still failed!! Dusted my engine so bad with aluminum dust the oil sample analysis drawn with oil the that only had 100 miles on it as well picked up the aluminum in the oil!!

 

[fubar569]

My last Gen 6 3.8 lasted less then 100 miles, 3-4 street pulls and 3 4th gear dyno pulls and the rotors ate each other and the housing this time too!!
+10 ATI lower and 3.50 Satera CLUTCHED UPPER PULLEY and it still failed!! Dusted my engine so bad with aluminum dust the oil sample analysis drawn with oil the that only had 100 miles on it as well picked up the aluminum in the oil!!


View attachment 132944 View attachment 132945 View attachment 132946

Id have burnt HQ to the ground after that.

 

[16GoManGoHC2]

Id have burnt HQ to the ground after that.

That’s when I threw in the towel with Whipple, I sold the warranty replacement while it was still new in the box.

 

[Jroc]

I located a seemingly proven Gen 5 3.0 Stage 2 kit about 3hrs away from home - 3k miles so if there were any serious issues they'd have surfaced by now. Also likely out of warranty though.

I've never been more tempted but dammit whipple...

Also...waiting to see if I accidentally fall into an 04 Mach 1 for a sensible no f#%ks given daily and drag week plan B before I get super tarded with either the hellcat or a chevelle.

An Azure Blue 04 Mach 1 popped up for sale near me last year for $9000 Canadian, absolutely smoking deal. If I hadn’t just dropped $25k on speed parts for the Hellcat when I saw it I’d probably be driving a boosted coyote swapped Mach 1 right now as a race car and have returned the Hellcat to stockish for sunny day cruising.

 

[GNBRETT]

I hear ya but the problem no one makes anything better its so rediculous there is ONE blower for everyone to choose from that makes big power such a joke smh cmon Magnuson stop being so fuking lame!

That’s when I threw in the towel with Whipple, I sold the warranty replacement while it was still new in the box.

 

[Jack_Toepfer]

Every generation has had an issue btw. They continue to improve but countless ppl have had zero issues with gen 5's. Maybe some are just built better idn.

I think tune plays a roll sometimes but not always. Once them rotors become unstable they become unhappy quick. Ive seen a few friends with 3.0 whipple gen 5's making BIG power and never having an issue ever. I have a 3.8 so I guess we will see how long it lives this year lol

Not sure why they just dont offer billet rotors for the new generation models. Especislly for the 3.8 since its gonna be making quite a bit more power than the 3.0.

It really sux there is only ONE player in this entire league! So rediculous I have to chose Whipple or chose nothing smh such a joke. Like where is Magnuson? Where is VMP for this platform? Edlebrock? Its such a huge market I just cant wrap my head around why there is ONE blower to choose from so frustrating.

They don’t play because they’re all using the same Eaton 2650 roots pack, right? The only twin screws have been Whipple and Kenne Bell. Doesn’t KB have something? You could always ask 007.

 

[GNBRETT]

Kenny Bell's are great on the dyno but on the street they tend to heat up really fast which is why no one runs them. VMP makes blowers for Mustangs why not branch out and make em for Hellcats the market is surely there. I would be ok with a Procharger if one could keep up with the Whipple.

I just dont get Magnuson. (5) years ago they leaked the SEMA photos on the 3.1 Liter and 5 years later...... crickets smh. The 2650 is still the best blower out there on 93 octane tho which is what most ppl run here. An updated blower would make stupid power on 93 octane I bet.

But eveyone gets hung up on the Whipple dyno numbers on E85 and automatically rule out the Magi over the Whipple but the reality is the Magi makes more power than both the 3.0 and 3.8 at lower boost levels where 93 octane is run. Plus it runs cooler and more effeciently.

They don’t play because they’re all using the same Eaton 2650 roots pack, right? The only twin screws have been Whipple and Kenne Bell. Doesn’t KB have something? You could always ask 007.

 

[fubar569]

Probably because Magnuson tried the same 3100 rotor pack from Eaton but in a fancy housing. Kong had a 3100 in development for the LS platform and abandoned it too. Perhaps the 3100 setup is just hot garbage all around for some reason?

 

[JDSHellcat]

Would be nice to have other options for sure!! In the process of having a 426 built with Thitek heads and still at a crossroads on which way to go for the power adder. Already have an SHR trans with Demon convertor, so would really like for whipple to get their shit figured out, the 3.8's are making some big power and backing it up at the track!!

But not a lot of fun having to send the charger back into whipple all the time either.

 

[GNBRETT]

Well, I have (3) Turbo cars and (2) Blower cars and I did consider the TT set up but after finishing the stroker build with Thiteks and putting the 3.8 on it ive never been happier with how it performs so dont give up on the 3.8 yet. If mine breaks I'll fix it period. Performs better than any of my Turbo cars by a LONG shot.....

TT's are simply not a better option for someone driving it on the street. At the track who cares I can build boost all day long but not on the street. Thing is just violent. Remember the Turbo's will require a 3800+ stall to make any power. Thats lame AF on the street.

Thats what I have in my Turbo Mustang but it weighs 3400 lbs so hardly apples to apples but its still somewhat slow to spool. My Trackhawk would absolutely crush my Mustang on the street unless I was able to build some boost.

I break all 4 tires lose with my Trackhawk at low speeds so make sure u switch to a 15 inch rim with a MT Pro Radial tire. A 17 inch rim with a Street R will NOT cut it. Ull be a skating pond going down the hiway with all that power ur now making and it will be sketchy AF and put u in the woods.

Ull make 1400 whp on pump E85. It was (E68) for me. 3.2 Pulley and u need the tensioner or it will slip at 6k rpm's at 23 lbs of boost. I couldnt get past 6k rpms without belt slip. Still made 1280 whp tho lol before I put the tenioner on and picked up another 120 whp. John Moored tuned it. He is the MAN!!!!!

And remember ur about 600-900 lbs lighter than I am so keep that in mind when considering a TIRE cause ull melt them without the Pro Radial. My Turbo Mustang on pump 93 octane makes 1100 whp / 900 ft lbs of TQ. I was lighting up those Street R's up like they were stock radial tires off a Prius smfh. Once I switched to the Pro Radial it was like I slapped Velcro onto the tires! They work THAT much better!

Ull also need a bigger hood that 3.8 wont fit under the stock hood with that giant intercoller. Atleast 2150 injectors. Cant run 93 octane any longer is case u were wondering it will be married to E85 now. I would probably opt for the ID2600's tho. I think when the next Whipple comes out them 2150's will be taped out but maybe not.....

It hits so freaking hard bro ull shit urself the TQ these things put out its really freaking wild! Right on par with Turbo's actually. Its literally like a freaking light switch! Turbo's just dont do that......

Would be nice to have other options for sure!! In the process of having a 426 built with Thitek heads and still at a crossroads on which way to go for the power adder. Already have an SHR trans with Demon convertor, so would really like for whipple to get their shit figured out, the 3.8's are making some big power and backing it up at the track!!

But not a lot of fun having to send the charger back into whipple all the time either.

 

[fubar569]

I am like...3hrs away from that complete proven 3.0 Stage 2 kit and a weekend away from an easy 4 digit sheet. Told my buddy he better start talking to his wife because if she doesn't move off that Mach 1 soon I'm probably gonna need a shortblock by July.

 

[JDSHellcat]

Well, I have (3) Turbo cars and (2) Blower cars and I did consider the TT set up but after finishing the stroker build with Thiteks and putting the 3.8 on it ive never been happier with how it performs so dont give up on the 3.8 yet. If mine breaks I'll fix it period. Performs better than any of my Turbo cars by a LONG shot.....

TT's are simply not a better option for someone driving it on the street. At the track who cares I can build boost all day long but not on the street. Thing is just violent. Remember the Turbo's will require a 3800+ stall to make any power. Thats lame AF on the street.

Thats what I have in my Turbo Mustang but it weighs 3400 lbs so hardly apples to apples but its still somewhat slow to spool. My Trackhawk would absolutely crush my Mustang on the street unless I was able to build some boost.

I break all 4 tires lose with my Trackhawk at low speeds so make sure u switch to a 15 inch rim with a MT Pro Radial tire. A 17 inch rim with a Street R will NOT cut it. Ull be a skating pond going down the hiway with all that power ur now making and it will be sketchy AF and put u in the woods.

Ull make 1400 whp on pump E85. It was (E68) for me. 3.2 Pulley and u need the tensioner or it will slip at 6k rpm's at 23 lbs of boost. I couldnt get past 6k rpms without belt slip. Still made 1280 whp tho lol before I put the tenioner on and picked up another 120 whp. John Moored tuned it. He is the MAN!!!!!

And remember ur about 600-900 lbs lighter than I am so keep that in mind when considering a TIRE cause ull melt them without the Pro Radial. My Turbo Mustang on pump 93 octane makes 1100 whp / 900 ft lbs of TQ. I was lighting up those Street R's up like they were stock radial tires off a Prius smfh. Once I switched to the Pro Radial it was like I slapped Velcro onto the tires! They work THAT much better!

Ull also need a bigger hood that 3.8 wont fit under the stock hood with that giant intercoller. Atleast 2150 injectors. Cant run 93 octane any longer is case u were wondering it will be married to E85 now. I would probably opt for the ID2600's tho. I think when the next Whipple comes out them 2150's will be taped out but maybe not.....

It hits so freaking hard bro ull shit urself the TQ these things put out its really freaking wild! Right on par with Turbo's actually. Its literally like a freaking light switch! Turbo's just dont do that......

GNBRETT,

thanks for all the insight. I have had a couple DM's with jon. HE also seems like a really nice and bright guy. The previous owner of the car had the transmission and other work done at HHP, so was an easy transition to bring the car back to them.

Its making 904, 955 right now on e-85, I also have a TT roush, and I'm with you...I love the supercharger and that I don't need a big stall convertor.

Car is scheduled to go in with Josh at HHP in May and he is going to do a 93 octane tune and a race gas tune, so will see how the 93 tune works with a 3.8 if I still end up going that route. HHP is who tuned it as it sits now, and I couldn't be happier as to how well the car drives and acts. Seems like a normal car till you decide to floor it!!

I'm doing the 15" conversion as well. I do have the 17" street r's, but like you say, they won't hook unless I'm on a prepped track.


thanks again, I appreciate all of the insight. Hope to see and meet some of you at some MSHS events this summer.

 

[GNBRETT]

TT Roush huh? Sweet! I bought my Aluminum block thru Josh. Great bunch of guys to deal with. He convinced me on the Aluminum after they broke (3) stock blocks that year.

Im guessing they were running them to their limits tho. Says he hasnt had one issue since swapping to an Aluminum block but im guessing 1500 whp+ they ran them at.

Ur gonna have one beast for sure! Geeez things gonna melt tires at 100 mph lol... Lots of feelings will be hurt lol.

Oh u can go 93 octane with the 3.8 but ull have to run it at lower boost levels with a big pulley which means ull need 1700 injectors or smaller. That 3.8 requires GOBS of fuel. 1700 injectors wont cut it if u plan on running 24-25 lbs of boost with the 130mm TB. Zero chance of that.

Ur not just slapping on a 3.8 to a stock CI motor ur going all out 426/Thitek heads so the point here is to get the maximum amount of power that set up will produce and it aint happening on 1700 injectors. No free lunch here bro..... If u feel u need 93 octane u will be sacrificing LOTS of Power/TQ cause u just cant get there with the 1700's they cant keep up.

I wish I could do both but it doesnt really make sense to go 3.8 if ur limited by injector. Just go 3.0 it will be more effecient. The whole point of the 3.8 is to make BIG power on E85.

Mine requires (3) 525 Hellcat fuel pumps with (3) Boost-a-Pumps. Im guessing u can have a 93 octane tune to putt around in or limp back home with if u cant get E85 but no way ur making max power on it so whats really the point then?

GNBRETT,

thanks for all the insight. I have had a couple DM's with jon. HE also seems like a really nice and bright guy. The previous owner of the car had the transmission and other work done at HHP, so was an easy transition to bring the car back to them.

Its making 904, 955 right now on e-85, I also have a TT roush, and I'm with you...I love the supercharger and that I don't need a big stall convertor.

Car is scheduled to go in with Josh at HHP in May and he is going to do a 93 octane tune and a race gas tune, so will see how the 93 tune works with a 3.8 if I still end up going that route. HHP is who tuned it as it sits now, and I couldn't be happier as to how well the car drives and acts. Seems like a normal car till you decide to floor it!!

I'm doing the 15" conversion as well. I do have the 17" street r's, but like you say, they won't hook unless I'm on a prepped track.


thanks again, I appreciate all of the insight. Hope to see and meet some of you at some MSHS events this summer.

 

[RGPIII]

Like @GNBRETT said the 3.8 matched to a 426 with Thitek heads will require a ton of fuel to make the power you want to run fast at the track. Now knowing how HHP operates, if your going on race fuel instead of Ethanol, what you are asking for is easily obtainable with way less fuel system. you could run a set of 1300's dual pumps, the 4.0 upper pulley and 93 for the street. then put Q16 in the tank and put a 3.25 upper making 26-28psi for the track. But be very aware Q16 is more than 10 times the cost of E85. Q16 is $30 a gallon. E85 is $2.99 a gallon.

 

[fubar569]

I'm beginning to wonder myself if I would rather pay for the fuel system or the cost of fuel. Either way they have you by the balls.

The injectors alone are more than double what my dual pump system cost originally. Oof.

 

[RGPIII]

Will need at least 2150's, triple pumps, and 2 baps.

 

[RGPIII]

Q16 will be very tough on spark plugs and o2 sensors. so expect some additional maintenance there as well. believe me I often consider my options going back to it. Pros and cons to both

 

[Marc W]

Like @GNBRETT said the 3.8 matched to a 426 with Thitek heads will require a ton of fuel to make the power you want to run fast at the track. Now knowing how HHP operates, if your going on race fuel instead of Ethanol, what you are asking for is easily obtainable with way less fuel system. you could run a set of 1300's dual pumps, the 4.0 upper pulley and 93 for the street. then put Q16 in the tank and put a 3.25 upper making 26-28psi for the track. But be very aware Q16 is more than 10 times the cost of E85. Q16 is $30 a gallon. E85 is $2.99 a gallon.

Interesting equation from a cost standpoint. The E85/426 with a 3.8 Whipple combination is starting to require injectors that are not going work with pump gas to drive on the street. At some point the injectors needed for 1500hp ethanol motors are too big for pump gas. Does anybody have that combination running on the street with pump gas using 2150 or bigger injectors? Also…. Interesting side on injectors. Everybody is looking at ID and FIC injectors. You all know that they are Bosch injectors with pixie dust sprinkled to double the price. Right? We use the same Bosch injectors with the same flow match pixie dust from FIVE0 Motorsport Injectors in California. 2200cc at 45 psi - 2550cc at 58 psi. Do the math. A set of eight is $1400.